An Open Conversation With Christian McBride -by Nicholas Payton

“Jazz is nothing but a terminology. BAM is a terminology. It’s just a phrase that’s been created for identification. Think about black people in general in this country. We’ve been called Negro, Colored, Black, Afro-American and now African American. Who decides these terms? Are they bad, good, or neutral? Or, are they just simply terms? Jazz has always been Black American music and musicians who play it no matter what culture they’ve come from need to understand that and I know deep down inside do understand that. To actually start calling it BAM is unrealistic. If you do that, then you’ll have to start calling hip hop Bam. We will have to change Soul music to Bam, Gospel music to BAM and Blues to BAM. Maybe we should drop all terminologies for all kinds of music? I believe musicians have already starting do that. Musicians are the ones to not see no genres or boundaries. I look at someone like Herbie Hancock who sees no boundaries and looks at music like this big palette with all these different colors. It doesn’t matter what people call it all you have to do is agree with it or not and move forward. Jazz has always been Black American music. I am not going to start calling it BAM because I know in my heart that it already is “BAM”. I just think it’s an incomplete strategy to call it BAM because the next generation is going to end up calling it something else and so will the next generation after that. Just like we call the black people of America it changes every generation.”

- Christian McBride

 It Ain’t Just A Word

First, McBride, the j-word is not just a terminology, it’s an idea, an idea that hasn’t served the music, its artists or the audience very well. Besides those who are hip enough to know better, most people in this world want nothing to do with the j-word. I don’t blame them, neither do I. You may know it’s Black music, Christian, but there are quite a few folks out there that have found me wanting to formally declare J***, Black music, a threatening proposal. Why is that? You may think everyone playing this music knows deep down inside that it comes from the Black community, but this is not widely accepted. As you know, the less your music has to do with anything remotely Black these days, the more it’s celebrated.

I’m sure about 90% of your life is consumed with living, breathing, sleeping and eating things associated with that j-word. Words are the basis for communication. We speak in words, we think in words, so to say that J*** or #BAM is just a terminology is false. #BAM is more than music, it’s a movement. All social change has come about as the result of a movement. Think about how powerful it would be to change the name of something that has been in place for about 100 years.

The Evolution of The Nigger

McBride, you give an excellent example of how Black people in this country have gone from being called Negro, Colored, Black, Afro-American to African-American. I’d like to add another name to that list: Nigger. Are these just terminologies, too? Nothing is just a terminology. If what you name something is nothing more than a terminology, then Black people should have no problem still being publicly called Nigger, Negro or Colored. We don’t accept those “terminologies” anymore because they are derogatory and don’t suit Black people. It’s already challenging enough for Blacks to be accepted as equals in this country being called African-Americans (which I don’t like, by the way). How much more challenging would it be to be treated fairly if we still accepted being called Nigger, Negro or Colored?

Like Nigger, Negro and Colored, the j-word has too much of a negative history to ever be socially respected. You talked in this interview about how the music formerly known as J*** doesn’t have the recognition it deserves, I agree, that’s one reason why the name needs to be changed. From the beginning, J*** was the type of music dads didn’t want their daughters listening to. My father and his classmates were not allowed to play Black music in the practice rooms of Xavier University because it was viewed as the Devil’s music. As an educator, I often hear students refer to Classical music as “legitimate” music as opposed to the j-word. Our music is viewed as a bastard orphan largely due to the fact that Black people created it. Years ago “The King of The J Word”, Paul Whiteman, was on a mission to “make a lady out of j***” by combining elements of Negro music with the European classical tradition. This is a trend that has continued to this very day.

Dvorak Believed In #BAM

Fact is, we never needed anyone else to “legitimize” our music.

“In the Negro melodies of America I discover all that is needed for a great and noble school of music. They are pathétic, tender, passionate, melancholy, solemn, religious, bold, merry, gay or what you will. It is music that suits itself to any mood or purpose. There is nothing in the whole range of composition that cannot be supplied with themes from this source. The American musician understands these tunes and they move sentiment in him.”

“I am convinced that the future music of this country must be founded on what are called Negro melodies. These can be the foundation of a serious and original school of composition, to be developed in the United States. These beautiful and varied themes are the product of the soil. They are the folk songs of America and your composers must turn to them.”  

-Antonin Dvorak

Why #BAM Is Necessary

#BAM ain’t unrealistic. There has never been a more realistic and complete idea for this music, ever. I didn’t create #BAM, #BAM has always existed. I am The Creator of #BAM which means that I’ve broken down the barriers that have separated what was meant to be together. Hate me if you want, but don’t hate #BAM. #BAM is beautiful.

#BAM is The Truth

#BAM ain’t separatist, it’s patriotic. It seems that so many are caught up on the Black part that they forget I also said American. #BAM is the umbrella under which all Black music stands. There is no need to rename soul, R&B, blues, gospel or hip-hop “BAM” because they are already #BAM and no one argues from which community those genres derive. As soon as you say the j-word, people don’t see how soul, R&B and hip-hop are just modern extensions of the music formerly known as J***.

Whitewashing The Black Out of The J Word

Why is it that when you say something is Black, many White people feel offended? I believe it’s because White people are so used to owning Blacks they likewise feel entitled to everything Blacks own, so to say Black American music reminds them they didn’t create it and that we are not willing to be co-opted under the banner of the j-word. The j-word allows the world to forget that the music formerly known as J*** comes out of Black community.

In 2010, Texas legislators were able to convince textbook manufacturers to take out slavery from the then current batch of books, which invariably affects what kids are taught across the country. Any reference to slavery has been omitted from American history and the Atlantic Slave Trade has now been dubbed the Atlantic Triangular Trade. As a result, for the next 10 years, students will be taught that slavery didn’t exist. That’s a generation of children who will be falsely educated because of these racist revisionists. People are literally whitewashing history before our eyes. As we start 2012, the same thing is happening in Tennessee right now. Legal precedents can be lethal. For those who feel secure about the future of Black music, don’t think this can’t happen to us. If we’re not careful, in 20 years, Duke Ellington will be White.

Daddy Warbucks Pumping Us From Behind

I’m tired of our artists and musicians shuckin’ and jivin’ to people for handouts. Our music should be able to stand alone as a respectable art form worthy of appreciation and support because it’s good music. I’m so embarrassed to see cats pandering for money on Kickstarter. It’s a bad look all around.

“If you get a billionaire to say they really love jazz and create a movement to say jazz is cool, it would be cool overnight. We need money pumped behind jazz in order to create a lifestyle because that’s what happened in hip hop.”  

-Christian McBride

The last thing we need is getting pumped from behind by any more billionaires, we’ve endured enough of that. What we need is to separate from the idea that we depend on donors and endowments to survive. It’s a colonialist mindset that indulges that type of negative thinking pattern. If we claim our rightful place as the progenitors of the American popular song, only then will we be cool overnight because people would see that all of the pop music they listen to now is just an offshoot of #BAM. That’ll never happen as long as this music continues to call itself J***.

The music formerly known as J*** has a much longer history than hip-hop. The problem is when you call what we do J***, it separates itself from hip-hop instead of showing the world that hip-hop is just the current version of what J*** used to be. When you drop the name J*** and call it #BAM, it makes what we do relevant again. #BAM gives new life not only to what we do, but also shows the young hip-hop heads that what they think is cool goes back a lot further than the Bronx and DJ Kool Herc, though I doubt many hip-hop fans of today have any idea who Kool Herc is.

The music you call J*** and hip-hop are both from the streets. They are Black, communal musics that serve a social, spiritual and practical purpose. There is no difference between the spirit of J*** and the spirit of hip-hop except the times and the players have changed. The music typically remains unscathed in its natural habitat. It’s precisely the moment Daddy Warbucks steps in and starts pumping money into the art form that all the problems begin. J*** is already dead and hip-hop is soon to follow, if it ain’t dead already. And you think this is what will save the music? That’s exactly what’s killing it.

You must also remember that the j-word was once the preeminent pop music of its time. The 1920s was dubbed The J*** Age. The heyday for J*** has come and gone. No one needed any subsidies, just like hip-hop doesn’t now. J*** died in 1959. That word is not big enough for what most of us do. It’s time to revolutionize and claim our proper place in the canon of American popular music, and as The Savior of Archaic Pop, it’s my duty to see that it happens.

#BAM is bigger than music. #BAM has the same cultural implications the civil rights movement had and the potential to change the world once again as #BAM did in the 20th century.

Great social change has always started with a movement.

You want this music to be cool again? Look no further, the movement has already begun and no “Daddy Warbucks” had to put his hand on a Nigger’s shoulder to validate him to the world in order for us to create a new lifestyle for ourselves.

We need to stop waiting for permission from someone to grant us what we know we deserve, and rightfully claim what’s ours. Life is not a fairy tale. No billionaire is going to drop down from the sky and save us. We must save ourselves.

The movement is #BAM.

Didn’t you write a suite called The Movement Revisited? There’s power in self naming. Two of the Black figures you honored in your piece (Malcolm X and Muhammad Ali) both  understood the strength in shunning a slave name.

What You Call It Does Matter

You say in one part of the piece, “It doesn’t matter what people call it all you have to do is agree with it or not and move forward.”  Then you say, “I am not going to start calling it BAM because I know in my heart that it already is BAM.” If it doesn’t matter what you call it, why do you have a problem calling it #BAM, and if in your heart it’s already #BAM, then why not call it that? It’s like saying you love chicken and in your heart you know it’s chicken, but you’re not going to call it “chicken”. McBride, that makes no sense whatsoever.

#BAM Ain’t A Strategy,

It’s A M o v e ment

#BAM ain’t a strategy. Saying it’s a strategy is like saying there’s some ulterior motive behind it all. #BAM is The Truth. The fact that we are Black American music artists isn’t a ploy of some sort, this is about respecting our ancestors and awakening people to aspire to be their best selves, not just Black people, everyone. That can’t happen if you’re not honest. Every nationality has a music to celebrate its plight and its people in which the world is invited to participate and enjoy. Why can’t Black American people have the same right to nationalistic pride? “Lift Every Voice and Sing!” That’s what #BAM is all about.

#BAM ain’t about me, it’s about we.

We the people….

- Nicholas Payton aka The Creator of #BAM aka The Savior of Archaic Pop

 

 

The Secret To #BAM

3 over 4 and 4 over 3.

That’s it.

#BAM

- Nicholas Payton aka The Creator of #BAM aka The Savior of Archaic Pop

To My Dear Doubting Uncle Thomas : An Open Letter To Greg Thomas

Don’t Fuck With Me Fellas!

I wasn’t going to respond, but I had to.  For no other reason than at this point it’s personal. If I paid attention to all the negative stuff floating about the Internet on me, I’d be consumed and unlike a lot of my pundits, I have a life. In this case, I’ve decided to make an exception. Truth is, Greg Thomas is simply mad because I cussed him out for disrespecting me on my Facebook page over a year ago. His desire to discredit me and #BAM is merely an attempt for him to get me back for hurting his feelings online.

Whatchu Know’ Bout Me?

He, like so many others, made the assertion that my post entitled On Sanctified Pussy…. came from an angry place, just as he assumed where my “Why The J-Word Isn’t Cool Anymore” came from.

Let me say this so that y’all hear: You Don’t Know Me!

You only know my Internet persona and my career as a musician. You’ve never hung out with me for an extended period of time, I have never confided in you about my personal life, you’ve never been to my house, I’ve never been to yours.  You Don’t Know Me!

I don’t have a problem with people who disagree, I do have a problem with people saying shit about me personally that isn’t true and making childish attacks. There’s a block/delete option for a reason and I intend to use it.

For one last time, I am not angry because I’m divorced and I’m not angry because of the way things went down with my former record label. I made the choice to leave both and they were two of the best, most liberating decisions I’ve ever made, sorry. No bitterness here. I’m just serious about what I believe and sometimes that means saying it strongly. Don’t hate because you’re a Mama’s boy or your wife got you pussy whipped. I speaks, sometimes softly, loudly or not at all, but whichever way it is I do it all the way.

It seems a lot of people these days have a hard time making the distinction between anger and passion. Don’t think I’m this choir-boy traditionalist the media made me out to be in the early ‘90s. That’s an image I fought to destroy for years. My first attempt was in 1998 on a piece in DownBeat magazine called, “Sex, Threads and J***.” It was all about how much I loved women, why cats should wear finer clothes and that the music formerly known as j*** should be sexier and more provocative. Many of my colleagues thought I had lost my mind for saying what I did in the article, even though the topics addressed in the article are standard fare for dressing room conversation amongst The Cats. Yeah, I’m crazy just because I have the balls to say what we all know to be true. The same thing I’m being vilified on the Internet for today.

You Talkin’ Dat Smack

I’ve been a shit-talker for years. Cats who I’ve opened up around know that. And when I say “shit-talker,” I don’t mean I’m full of shit. “Talking shit” as it pertains to New Orleans means someone is writing rather large checks with their words. We also say “talkin’ dat ying-yang,” “talking smack,” or “talkin’ dat smack.” “Talking smack” is the dude of the most diminutive stature saying he’s gonna whip everybody’s ass on the block. Now the question is: Can he back it up?

As we also say in NOLA, “Don’t let your mouth write a check your ass can’t cash.” So, yes, I talk a lot of shit but I can back it up, on or off the bandstand, with or without words.

Don’t Paint Me With Your Linear Brush.

Amongst musicians, I’m as notorious for my blunt critiques of the world as I am my shyness. Don’t paint me with your linear brush. There’s no “either/or” in life. I am a dynamic man with range. From the profound to the profane, I say it all. So don’t get it twisted because you met me and I was a total gentleman or a total dick, I am both and everything in between. It all depends on the context.

My People Are Destroyed For A Lack Of Knowledge

Just because my ancestors accepted something doesn’t mean I have to. That’s called evolution. As I said in the post that kicked this off,  “With all due respect to the masters, they were victims of a colonialist mentality. Blacks have been conditioned for centuries to be grateful for whatever crumbs thrown to them. As a postmodern musician, it’s my duty to do better than my predecessors. To question, reexamine and redefine what it is that we do. They accepted it because they had to. Because my ancestors opened the door for me, I don’t have to accept it.

Louis bowed and scraped so Miles could turn his back. It’s called evolution.”

Jazz Is Dead

 

The j-word is dead. It died in 1959. Those who celebrate it are worshipping a zombie.

Doubting Uncle Thomases

I’ve heard a lot of people say they disagree with me or they don’t agree with everything I’ve said, which is cool, but no one can really say what they disagree with. What they typically do is take one thing I’ve said out of context and completely distort it. No one has been able to make a cogent argument against what I’ve said. Why? Because I’m not “telling the truth as I see it,” I’m telling the truth. I am not expressing a viewpoint or taking a position, it’s the truth. I haven’t posted a lie yet.

It’s just like my associate Dezron Douglas who came to the #BAM conference and decided to make a stink about the fleur-de-lis on the #BAM t-shirt. Really? We talk about all this stuff and you’re worried about an emblem? Or Willard Jenkins who keeps saying I disagree with Nicholas saying “they” took the music away, we gave it away. I never put full onus on our oppressors. In my piece I say, “Jazz musicians have accepted the idea that it’s OK to be poor,” ”Jazz is a label that was forced upon the musicians. The musicians should’ve never accepted that idea.” “Chicken George” was a wise-old dude, but he was a victim of a colonialist mentality. It’s up to us younger folk to adopt a new way of thinking and the first place to start is a new name for this music. I also say that it’s ultimately our responsibility to change the status-quo, “Some people may say we are defined by our limitations. I don’t believe in limitations, but yes, if you believe you are limited that will define you.”

We were complicit in the slavery of our music just like our brothers and sisters in Africa assisted in the procuring of slaves during the Middle Passage. The “sell-out” is always key in slavery. No matter what was done to us, I ultimately blame us and it’s why I’ve started the #BAM movement.

I’m not just critiquing with words like Uncle Thomas, Willard Jenkins and Dezron Douglas; I’ve started a movement that has gained international momentum. It’s real easy for you to sit at a keyboard or yap your mouths about why I’m wrong or knit-pick about what I could do better, but I’m changing the way people think about this music.

None of y’all can make that claim!

Let’s be honest, those who hate on #BAM do so because they didn’t think of it first!

People Can’t Read

I’ve said this countless amounts of times, but no matter how much I repeat myself, some of you just don’t get it. Like I said in the piece, “Jazz ain’t music, it’s marketing, and bad marketing at that. It has never been, nor will it ever be, music.”  I also said in the follow-up, I am not dissing an art form. I am dissing the name, Jazz.” I was real clear, so why is it that Uncle Thomas says, “[Payton claims] that a form in which a plethora of musicians played, a host of fans listened to, and buckets of ink were typed in periodicals devoted to the music, was virtually or symbolically or actually dead after 1959, is obviously inaccurate. But since it’s a provocative statement that elicits discussion, I’ll take it with a grain of salt.” I never said the art form was dead, just the name. On the basis of your lack of understanding very basic things that I’ve said, I take what you say for a grain of salt, as we NOLA folks say.

I Don’t Play That Jizzle Ass Music!

 

 

As Saxophonist/Composer Loren Schoenberg said early on when my dissenters were coming at me, “Most reactions I’ve read delve into personal biography about how much jazz means to them, and how could it be dead if they’re not…ad nauseum. . . I found your piece thought-provoking and honest and it seems that most people’s problems with it reveal their lack of intellectual and creative curiosity.”

I would say, most certainly, Greg Thomas’ piece falls in this category.

Whoot, There It Is!

 

 

J***, It Up

 

As I said at the Inaugural #BAM Conference in New York City, I’m not trying to create converts. There are certainly things that deserve the j-word moniker.  You keep “J***in’ It Up, Uncle Thomas. You most certainly deserve to be in that category. #BAM ain’t for everyone.

J*** Hands!!

 

Racists, corny Ofays and Niggas, House & Field Niggers and just stupid people, period, should stick with the j-word, it’s where you belong!

 

#BAM

 

- Nicholas Payton aka The Creator of #BAM aka The Savior of Archaic Pop

#BAM Is For People Of All Races, Sexes, Cultures And Colors

No matter how many times I’ve said it, many of you still don’t get it.

#BAM is not exclusive to Blacks.

Not only have I written it dozens of times, but I’ve said it on air and on video repeatedly. Obviously at this point, it’s mostly non-Black folks who have a problem with a Black man saying it’s Black music. If you have a problem with the truth, so be it. Clearly a White, racist moniker (the j-word) for a serious Black art form is more comforting to you. The j-word didn’t all of a sudden become racist, it was racist at its inception.

If you don’t believe me listen to Gary Bartz say it:

If that’s not enough, check out Miles’ disdain for the word @ 1:47:

And if you’re still not convinced, here’s Max Roach @ 7:47:

And if you need further proof check Mingus @ 12:56:

If you don’t except my word for it, please listen to my elders.

There have been many White #BAM musicians:

Chet Baker

Stan Getz

George Shearing

Bonnie Raitt

Michael McDonald

to name a few….

#BAM doesn’t seek to exclude or separate itself from other races and/or cultures. #BAM’s primary mission is to strip itself away from the derogatory j-word and to acknowledge that though anyone can play it, it is indeed a Black creation.

Some may ask why does the fact that it’s Black music bear acknowledgement. To that I say, what is known and accepted by some is not known and accepted by all and it’s an important factor to the music’s heritage.

This music can be enjoyable, but it is NOT a hobby.

This music is Black people’s path to freedom and we invite everyone to join the ride.

I you haven’t gotten it by now, I hope this helps.

#BAM

- Nicholas Payton aka The Creator of #BAM aka The Savior of Archaic Pop

Biblically Debunking Homosexuality : Once And For All

Leviticus Faggot

From a Judeo-Christian perspective, I believe there to be a difference in scriptural reference and biblical law. For instance, the bible says in Leviticus 18:22 says, “Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.” What does that mean really? If we take it literally, it is not physically possible to lie (have sex) with a man as you can with a woman as they are sexually not the same. You can pretend a penis is a vagina, but anatomically speaking, they are different. Even still, is this a sin for which God will punish by death?

Bacon Loving, Jesus Freaks!

“And the swine, because it divideth the hoof, yet cheweth not the cud, it is unclean unto you: ye shall not eat of their flesh, nor touch their dead carcasse.” -Deuteronomy 14:8 

Leviticus says both pork and homosexuality are abominations, yet I’ve witnessed many a Christian chompin’ back on bacon. Leviticus 11:12 says. “Whatever in the water does not have fins or scales; that shall be an abomination to you.” There is scriptural reference to this as well, but somehow in the hierarchy of what God says for us not to do, Christian fundamentalists universally let this one go. Why will a woman go to hell for sleeping with another woman, but you can eat all the McRibs you want and still make it into The Pearly Gates

oBAManation!

 

Like I said, I think there is a big difference between a scriptural reference and a biblical law. In both passages in Levitcus it says lying with another man and eating shellfish are an abomination. Who is the arbiter of which abomination is more sinful than the other? If all homosexuals are to die because God said it was an abomination, then all people who eat crabcakes are going to hell, too!

Biblical Law

There is a big difference between scriptural reference and biblical law. Context is everything. Just because the bible says we are or are not to do something does not mean it’s forever in perpetuity. For instance, Leviticus 19:19 says, “Ye shall keep my statutes. Thou shalt not let thy cattle gender with a diverse kind: thou shalt not sow thy field with mingled seed: neither shall a garment mingled of linen and woollen come upon thee.” Do Christians still live by this? If this is the case, then it is a sin for a farmer to plant more that one thing in a field and for us to wear t-shirts!

Live At The Bottom Line

 

 

The 10 Commandments don’t say anything about homosexuality and it certainly doesn’t fall under The Golden Rule. Christians don’t get to decide which abomination is permissible and which is not. So either quit eating pork or leave the gays alone!

God is love.

 #BAM

 - Nicholas Payton aka The Creator of #BAM aka The Savior of Archaic Pop


The Nicholas Payton Television Studio Orchestra Live At Birdland 1/6/12

#BAM

- Nicholas Payton aka The Creator of #BAM aka The Savior of Archaic Pop

The Inaugural #BAM Conference NYC 1/5/12

BAM at Birdland

NicholasPayton_Marquee_8x11

Sinatra + Basie = The Ultimate #BAM

#BAM

- Nicholas Payton aka The Creator of BAM aka The Savior of Archaic Pop

Interview With Josh Jackson on The Checkout

http://www.wbgo.org/thecheckout/nicholas-payton-black-american-music/#.TwOXoH2IoRo.facebook

#BAM